We have one primary goal this week: to observe Revelation 12 and 13 and look for information that relates to Daniel's vision in chapter 7. There are so many interesting details in these chapters that it's easy to get overwhelmed. Remember, though, we are not doing a study of Revelation; we are using these chapters as cross references to Daniel 7.
As you're studying, remember that our primary goal is to observe these chapters as objectively as we can. We will not interpret all the details, even though we may want to try! This week we're looking for information that sounds like things we read in Daniel 7.
You may be tempted to grab a commentary to see how someone explains the details in Revelation 12 and 13, but this is not the time. Keep them closed for now (that includes your wonderful study Bibles and all their notes!). Read these chapters over and over and try to stick with exactly what the text says. If you can't figure something out, that's okay. We need to observe, observe, and observe some more before we try to interpret! Put a little question mark next to the things you don't understand and move on. If you have a ton of question marks, don't worry about it. Maybe you'll find yourself erasing some of those question marks after awhile.
In the homework we're asked to interpret the woman mentioned in Revelation 12. You might find it helpful to grab a piece of paper and make a simple list of everything it says about her. After you make your list, look over it and think about what it says. You may not come up with a firm conclusion, but you could jot down your ideas. We'll talk about it on Wednesday. I've already had several conversations with some of you about this woman. So, if you're struggling to understand who she is, you've got company!! The process of figuring out who she might be is a good one. So hang in there and keep chewing on it!
If you will stick with this method of studying, you will learn what the Word of God says for yourself. It's definitely a process, so give yourself lots of grace and time. There are no shortcuts for becoming equipped in understanding the Bible and handling it accurately! It takes time and discipline.....but it's so worth it!
Remember to keep asking yourself what you're learning about your God as you study. In the midst of all your questions, is there anything that grabs you personally? Is God speaking to you through these chapters?
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I've never used a blog before and I am new to this study, but I wanted to give it a shot! I know that our class time is short and not a lot of time is given to personal comments for obvious reasons. But I really want to share what I think might be a different perspective than what I've heard in class...I hope this is the right forum to do so. I would love to know if anyone else has these same thoughts...
ReplyDeleteFirst, I think it is very interesting when you research the word "saints" in Daniel ch 7 v 21 that the root word is an aramaic ADJECTIVE that means "holy, seperate, angels or saints". If you look at the same word "saints" in Rev 13 v 7, it is a Greek adjective meaning most holy thing. The same greek word is used throughout the new testament for "Holy" in Holy Ghost. In the new testament it is clearly used to describe people. In Daniel I think the word saints could be talking about heavenly beings. For time frame issues, humans did not have a "holy" aspect until Jesus was resurrected and sent us the Holy Spirit. Does this support that Rev 13 is written about post resurrection believers?
Now here's something I wonder if anyone else has thought about...I may be crazy :).....
Revelation 12 is a clarification of what Daniel saw in ch7, but I think it is a picture of the 3 and a half years Jesus was in ministry. I think is brings clarity to John about what happened at the cross, not something that will happen and not Jesus "birth" from the womb. I think it was his "birth" into His ministry on Earth.
It says in v5 that "he was caught up to God". This did not happen until he rose again. After the cross there is a spiritual battle with "heavenly" saints (rev 12 v7 and daniel 7 v 21), the devil is defeated IN THE SPIRITUAL REALM (v9) and when Jesus rose again we were given all authority here on Earth along with salvation (rev v10 and daniel 7 v 22). We "earthly saints" overcome the attacks of the enemy with the blood of the Lamb, (rev 12 v11). This blood was not shed and available until the cross. I think the 2nd coming is referenced to in rev 12 v 12 when it says the devil knew he only had a short time.
Not a clue about the water...anyone have any ideas?
History shows that women have been persecuted along with the descendants of Israel.
Now, Rev 13 I think is a revelation of what is to come....a totally different 3 and half years. Part of tribulation maybe? I have more questions in this one...
v3 is the slain head a picture of the devil defeated at the cross?
I think its interesting that v6 specifies that the blasphemes were against heavenly things and v 7 the war seems to be with earthly saints. Does this support my theory about the different references to saints in Daniel and Revelation?
v8 I can not find any references to the Lambs Book of Life in the OT, which leads me to believe this is post resurrection.
I loved the parallels shared in class about the trinity. Everything the devil does is a counterfit to God....his plan is not new! He can only deceive...his only power. He has nothing original. Thank God for truth!
I hope it was ok to share all of this on here....I guess it won't be posted if not! It helped me sort through it all and solidify my ideas! :)
Katie...
ReplyDeleteThis blog is a good forum to share ideas about our study of Daniel. You're right, we're usually so busy on Wed mornings there isn't much time to share personal opinions. Yesterday's lesson was a good example of that! That's why we thought a blog would be helpful.
It was very difficult to tackle Rev 12-13 in 1 lesson! Since we had not done an overview of Rev or studied the preceding chapters, I did not feel qualified to interpret many of the details. But, there were a few conclusions I was willing to draw:
-I thought there were strong similarities between the 1st beast mentioned in Rev 13 and the 4th beast and little horn mentioned in Dan 7.
-At this point I think it's reasonable to interpret the woman in Rev 12 as Israel and the male child as Jesus. However, I intend to hold those interpretations in a rather loose hand, so to speak....knowing I have not done enough observation of Rev to be absolutely certain.
-Another conclusion I'm willing to draw at this point relates to the time phrase 'time, times, 1/2 time'. It seems to correspond to the 1260 days and 42 months mentioned in other passages....and can be reasonably interpreted to be 3 1/2 yrs. Are all these passages talking about the same 3 1/2 yrs....or could there be several 3 1/2 yrs? Well, at this point, I'm going to 'file' that observation and wait to interpret it.
In your comments you said that 'humans do not have a 'holy' aspect until Jesus was resurrected and sent us the HS'. According to numerous OT references, the nation of Israel was described as 'holy'...as well as individuals. Here are just a few examples to consider: Ex 19:6, 22:31, Lev 11:44-45, 19:2, 20:7,26, Num 6:5,8, Deut 14:2,21,28:9.
I'm quite sure there will continue to be differences in interpretations within our group. I greatly value the inductive study method which places great emphasis on objective observation before moving into objective interpretation. Hopefully we can agree to disagree on the non-essentials and enjoy the process of discovery as we continue in our study!
Katie –
ReplyDeleteI’m so glad you posted your thoughts! I love a good discussion and you’ve done a nice job bringing up some issues that will be fun to think through. You’ve also made me think about things in a way I never have before and might not have been inclined to had you not presented your ideas – so thanks! That said, however, after thinking further about the issues you’ve raised I’ve come to some different conclusions than I think you have, so I thought I might throw some thoughts out there for what it’s worth.
First, I’d like to address the issue of timing that you brought up because I think that issue presents us with a rather important bit of theology. A couple of things that you mentioned might be relevant here. First, that you don’t think people had “a holy aspect” until after the work of Christ on the cross. Second, you mentioned the Lamb’s book of life as not having mention in the Old Testament, and therefore being a purely New Covenant phenomenon. I think the Bible is fairly clear on both of these issues – here’s just a little bit of my reasoning…..
In numerous places in the OT, God declares that Israel, God’s chosen people, are a holy people. A few examples:
Ex 19:6 and you shall be to Me a kingdom of priests and a holy nation….
Ex 22:31 You shall be holy men to Me…..
Lev 11:45 ' For I am the LORD who brought you up from the land of Egypt to be your God; thus you shall be holy, for I am holy.'"
Lev 19:2 "Speak to all the congregation of the sons of Israel and say to them, ' You shall be holy, for I the LORD your God am holy.
Lev 20:26 'Thus you are to be holy to Me, for I the LORD am holy; and I have set you apart from the peoples to be Mine.
You get the point – there are a bunch more like this. But perhaps you’re still not convinced. You might say, sure the nation of Israel was set apart by God and therefore holy as a whole, but what about individuals? Ok, lets take a quick look at salvation as it occurred in the Old Testament. Several New Testament passages shed light on this issue and may persuade you, as they have me, that salvation was, is, and always will be through Jesus Christ – even before his death on the cross and resurrection!
First, take Abraham. Romans 4 speaks extensively to the salvation of Abraham. Paul explains here that Abraham was reckoned righteous because of his faith in the promise that God made to him. What was the promise that God made to Abraham? A seed. Who is the seed? Jesus! It was Abraham’s faith in God’s saving work through Christ yet to come that was his salvation. And he was reckoned righteous even in the Old Testament. The faith and righteousness of Abraham is also talked about in James 2. Secondly, I might also point you to Hebrews 11. Prior to the famous list of people (all from the Old Testament) the writer of Hebrews declares in verse 2 that “By it (faith) the men of old gained approval.” Then at the end of the chapter in verses 39-40 we see that the approval gained by these great men and women of faith who lived before Jesus was also based on the work of Christ and they had to wait for the promise in Jesus that we now have. So, although they lived without a full understanding of Jesus like we have today, they were believers in the fullest sense and gained salvation through faith in the promise of Jesus just as we do also – only they looked forward to Him and we look back. Thirdly, there are passages in the OT where people are declared righteous. In Gen 6:9 Noah is called righteous. Abraham is called righteous in the OT in Gen 15:6. Job talks about being righteous, as does David in the Psalms. So, holiness, righteousness, and salvation are all present in the Old Testament.
(out of room....more to come....)
(....continuing from before.....)
ReplyDeleteIn regards to the Lamb’s book of life, if you take a look at the beginning of verse 8 of Rev 13, there’s a time phrase there. It says that the names in the book were written before the foundation of the world. Eph 1:4 contains the same time phrase saying that “He (God) chose us in Him (Jesus) before the foundation of the world that we would be holy and blameless before Him.” Clearly, before the foundation of the world is also before the death and resurrection of Jesus. So I believe that the Lamb’s book of life contains the names of OT believers as well as NT believers. So, your point that “saints” in Dan 7 can’t refer to people because it was written before Jesus died on the cross……well, it’s just not working for me so much. J
Also, I have to point out that in Dan 7, when the saints are warring with LBH (little big horn J) they are given into his hand for time, times and half and time. Never do we see heavenly beings given into anyone’s hand, but we see the saints given into LBH’s hand in Dan and the beast’s hand in Rev. Recalling that those events took place on earth, as we determined in class on Wed, I think it stands to reason just from those texts alone that the saints are people.
I’m seriously running out of time here, but I want to VERY quickly address one other thing if I may. You mentioned that you think the 3.5 years in Rev is referring to the earthly ministry of Jesus. I’m just not sure I follow your logic here. I personally think you’re reading into the text a little too much – I just don’t see anything in the text myself that leads to that conclusion. Also, you seem, at least in part, to be basing that interpretation on your idea that salvation through Christ was inaccessible in the OT, which obviously I disagree with. But I’m still not sure I’m following you. I think the time, times, and half a time in Dan and in Rev and the 42 months are the same period of time based on the text, which of course would rule out the possibility of it referring to Jesus’ earthly ministry for me. Also, what would be the significance of it being Jesus’ time in ministry? Just curious. I’m not trying to attack you here!!! I just don’t get it – I guess I’m asking for clarification as to how you came up with that idea. Also, I’m by no means any kind of expert on Rev – I haven’t studied it other than those two chapters in this class and the fact that I’ve read it a couple of times….but that’s kind of like putting my brain in a blender. So, I might just not have the whole picture.
Ok, I really am out of time now! I really hope you aren’t offended by me disagreeing with you! I LOVE the fact that you posted your thoughts and I totally respect you for it! I’d love to get to know you a little better too – you’re clearly someone who is interested in thinking deeply about the Word of God and theology, so we have that in common. I look forward to hearing/reading more of your thoughts as we continue to study Daniel!
Hey Katie...thanks for posting your thoughts.
ReplyDeleteJust a few of my own to think about.
On the note of whether the "saints" talked about in Revelation 13 v 7 are post-resurrection believers:
For me...to accurately think through this...you have closely observe Daniel 7, Revelation 12 and Revelation 13. Let me explain why I think that. It seemed to be when I observed Rev 12 that it was immediately connected to Rev 13. I base that on the fact that the dragon in R12 is spoken of in the last verse...and then the very next chapter (remembering that in the original text there wouldn't have been chapter breaks) it starts with..."And the dragon stood on the sand of the seashore."
With that connection made for me between Rev 12 and 13 and then looking at the connections between both of those chapters and Daniel...my observations have led me to believe they are connected in a very close and important way.
So to then make the assumption that Daniel 7 is talking about one group of saints (heavenly beings as you called them) and Rev 12 is talking about another group of saints (the brethren - who overcame the dragon) and then that Rev 13 is talking about a yet different group of "saints" (post resurrection believers)...is a HUGE leap for me. It doesn't stick with what I've observed through the text and in my opinion leads to some big assumptions.
I also agree with Nell Anne and Leah on the note that "saints" in the OT was a legit reference to people and is very feasible as an option, but that has been thoroughly covered so I won't spend more time one that.
One other thing I wanted to talk more about.
The Revelation 12 idea that is is referring to Jesus' ministry and is a clarification to John of what happened on the cross.
I didn't see where you specificed who you thought the "woman" was referring to. I think you could make some arguments for your case, such as the dragon standing over the woman to devour the child...maybe that was the devil waiting to tempt Jesus in the desert?? Not really sure. But my biggest issues are the holes in that theory.
Who is your woman? Why would they flee into the wilderness for 1,260 days and if this is talking about the past as we know it from the bible and history...why wasn't that flee into wilderness recorded for us? And if the war in heaven has already happened and we have already overcome Satan why do numerous NT authors warn us about coming battles and how to protect ourselves. If this battle happened after Jesus' ministry and the cross...and the devil is no longer accusing us, why did it speak in Peter of "the devil...asking to sift you like wheat." It seems to me that at Peter's time and even much later in the bible we are warned that the devil is still prowling around...so it doesn't seem like we've completely overcome him yet.
more to come...
Ok...you said
ReplyDelete"I think its interesting that v6 specifies that the blasphemes were against heavenly things and v 7 the war seems to be with earthly saints. Does this support my theory about the different references to saints in Daniel and Revelation?"
I kind of addressed this earlier about using close observations to see the connections between Dan 7, Rev 12 and Rev 13...but one more thought on that.
Those two verses seem connected to me...in that this beast will want to set himself up as the God who should be served (hence the job of beast #2 - to get all people to worship him as a god-type) but it still seems to go perfectly together...the beast will blaspheme against God and then war with those on earth who won't follow his lead.
When you observe Dan 7 it is almost identical language...this "Little Horn" will speak out against the Most High and vs 21- war with the saints, or vs 25-wear down the saints.
Also...if the "saint" in Daniel 7 are angelic or heavenly beings...it says in vs 22 that the saints will take possession of the kingdom. But I don't see any other support of this in the bible...where angels are going to be given the kingdom. But in Rev 20:4 it does specifically say that those who had not worshiped the beast or the image would be ruling with Christ. So I do see that "saints" or people that are Christians will be ruling with Christ and given a kingdom.
I'm having so much fun that I'll say one more thing.
You wondered about this...
v3 is the slain head a picture of the devil defeated at the cross?
Well, if it is...then that would make the beast in Revelation that the devil gave all power and authority the devil himself...it was pretty clear in my observations that there was the dragon from rev 12...clearly marked out as the devil...and then there was a different beast that the devil gave authority and power too...and that beast had the slain head...not the dragon...so how would the beasts head be a picture of the slain devil at the cross. And if I'm correct there will only be one time the devil is given an "injury" and that is the lake of fire which he will never heal from.
If it was a picture of the devil defeated at the cross...why did it heal and is he still working or when he was defeated...was he defeated at the cross so that he is done and hasn't been working or attacking since then?
Lots of questions come up for me if the slain head is a picture of his defeat at the cross.
Anywho...this has truly been good to talk about as far as typing out my thoughts and beliefs. I do think it helps me reason through some of what I think I believe and why. I think everyone needs to be able to give a reason for why they believe what they do...and be able to back it up with scripture.
So, thanks Katie! You may not know me that well...but I love deep discussions like this.
What are you thoughts on the sovereignty of God and election?? TOTALLY JOKING!!! PLEASE DON'T START THAT TOPIC>>>NELL ANNE WOULD KILL ME AND CUT ME INTO TINY PIECES!!! :) :D :) :D
Well.....obviously you all have a lot more experience with "observing the text" than I do! I appreciate all the insight and thoughts. Leah, thanks for all the references concerning holiness and righteousness in the OT...the scriptures that you and Nell Anne shared were similar and still left me wondering because many of them say you "shall" be holy and are in the context of keeping the law. We know that was not accomplished or there wouldn't have been a need for Jesus. So were they holy? However, the later references that Leah shared were great! I had forgotten about Abraham and what was said about him in Romans....thanks for helping me sort through that! I also appreciate your insight about the "Lambs Book of Life".
ReplyDeleteAs far as my ideas about the 3.5 years...I spent Wednesday evening thinking about my thoughts...:)....and I had concluded that I think the birth was actually His birth....He left His throne to come to Earth as a man which lines up with being swept up to the throne at his "birth" in the passage. I originally was thinking about Him going to sit at the right hand after His ressurection and I think that is what got me started on the path of the 3.5 years being His ministry time. I need to concentrate on allowing the scripture to be literal and not "read too much into it" as you said. Thanks!
Cheri...thank you as well! The OT is not something I have ever spent a lot of time studying. This is pretty new to me :)! As far as the slain head....I do believe he was defeated for believers then and yet to come at the cross. I don't think that means that he can't attempt to wage war. But do we lose? His defeat was our victory. I think his defeat means that in every battle we have the victory. And his only weapon is lying. If we choose not to believe his lies, we hold victory every time. I think that if I am reading correctly and my thoughts have been cleared up about the saints, then he in a way gets one last shot right? I guess my thought process was that it had been "healed" for this one last attempt....it was kind of a shot in the dark just trying to make sense of all this, and I agree....as I have read your comments it doesn't really make sense!
Never a worry about being offended...I feel I am teachable and love to learn. I like to have my ideas challenged....its the only way to be sure you know it! And I want to be right....so I welcome people helping me get there! Looking forward to Wednesday. Thanks again.
I was lying in bed after that last post talking to my husband and had a thought. See what you think about this....
ReplyDeleteIn Genesis a prophecy was given to the devil about Eve and Jesus. It's Gen 3:15. God tells the devil that he will put enmity between him and woman (we all came from Eve) and between his offspring and her Offspring (notice the caps) or Jesus. It says He will bruise and tread your head and you will bruise his heel. The next verse describes the curse of labor pains.
Then there is a reference in my bible to Gal 4:4. That talks about the proper time coming and Jesus being born of a woman.
So....could the woman in Rev 12 be Eve figuratively and Mary literally? The 12 stars still represent the 12 tribes but depict the 12 tribes originating from Eve. She has great labor pains v2 (the curse) and it specifically talks about the devil being positioned in front of her v4. Could the healed wound on the dragons head in rev 13 be from Jesus heel? Hmmmm.
Ok, I only have like 5 seconds (seriously) cause Aiden is napping, I have to shower, clean my house, get ready to go shopping, and bake a wedding cake for like a million people. But I have to make this one clarification and then I'll try to write more later. Katie, I think you're still confusing the dragon and the beast in Rev. The dragon is the devil. The beast IS NOT. It was a head of the BEAST that appeared slain and was healed, not Satan. The beast seems to be connected to the beast in Dan and the little horn. It is clearly an instrument of Satan (since satan gave it power, authority, and a throne) but it's important to note that it is not Satan himself.
ReplyDeleteAs for your thoughts on Gen 3:15, I still think you're reading a little too much into things. Here's a QUICK though. Have you ever used Google Earth? You know how when you open the program you see a view of the entire earth as from space? Then if you type in a country, you'll zoom in to see that country a little closer? Then if you type in a city, you'll zoom in more and see more details. Then you can type in a street address and see more detail than you ever imagined possible from a satellite and it's way cool, right? That's kind of like these scriptures. Gen 3:15 is the whole earth - really big picture, not much detail to be seen. Dan is the regional zoom in. You get more details and start to see the place take shape. Rev is zooming in closer like to a city. It's the same place but you get to see more detail. Don't try to see a street address from the space view. Wait and zoom all the way in and look closely for it in the right country, region, state/province, city, neighborhood and then you'll have a better understanding of what you're seeing.
Sorry if that's totally cheesey. I'll try to write more at some point when I have another 5 seconds to spare!
I'll miss you all on Wed! Aiden hasn't been feeling well, so I'm going to keep him home, but it's about going to kill me to miss out! :-)
Leah
O.K. so I just spent about 30 min. on all these posts. Holy cow! Who knew such chitter chatter was going on... how fun! ;) I would love to be able to come to some sort of conclusion, but I realize I need to wait on that. This is all so fuzzy still for me. I'm not sure what I really think to be honest with you! I am looking foward to having things come into more of a focus as we move along in Daniel. Maybe we need to just spend a little more time in observation and try to hold off on a bulk of the interpretation... I know, I know... easier said than done! I love the fact that we are able to talk about things though.
ReplyDeleteStacy I agree! As soon as I think I have something figured out, I realize I left out an important detail or confused something. Today's class was great though! Kay Arthur really cleared some time issues up for me in her video, that is, if we agree with her interpretations right!?!?!?. I think I understand why Nell Anne tries so hard not to share her oppinions and kind of discourages us from really forming any hard ones yet. Looking forward to OBSERVING this weeks text. ;)
ReplyDeleteKatie...rather than talk back at you...I have a question.
ReplyDeleteSince you seem eager to "interpret"...I would ask you to explain to me your reasoning on the woman in Rev 12 being Eve figuratively and Mary literally. Because when we looked at it in class 2 weeks ago...I thought we ruled out both Eve and Mary because there were very specific parts of the scripture that didn't fit with those theories.
So I'm interested in how you came to the conclusion that it was those two women.
And...what your reasoning would be that made you rule out that the woman is the nation of Israel.
I should note this as well...when I first observed that chapter...both of those women also came to my mind as possible options. So I admit I am curious to hear your reasoning and see if it lined up with what I was thinking.
Cheri,
ReplyDeleteObviously we only know each other through our limited communication on this blog, so let me first start by trying to clear some things up...
First, my only desire, as I'm sure is yours, is for truth. I don't believe there is anything in the Word that we can't understand with time, study and the Holy Spirit's help. My thoughts and possible beliefs about certain things through this study that I have posted on here are NOT concrete yet in any form. Most of what I have posted I have put in question form because I am still trying to figure it all out. There have been times when I have posted something I am thinking about and then just hours later the Lord reveals something to me that changes my stance. Obviously none of us have time to blog every time we get revelation about something so I have not always been able to share those.
Second, if it seems I am "eager to interpret", its because I am!!! And I don't see how you could do this study without feeling that way. I think we all want to know what this all means. And while I understand the importance of observing the text at length, I also don't see anything wrong with trying to interpret as long as we remain open to changing that interpretation. :) (I have to do that a lot)
So....with all that being said, let me try to explain all my thoughts about the woman....
First, in the very beginning the only thought I had about the woman was that she was Israel. It made sense, the 12 stars being the 12 tribes that descended from Jacob (Israel) and the fact that Jacob calls himself and his wife the moon and sun in Genesis and the woman was depicted with the moon and sun, and we all know Jesus came from Israel, I didn't really consider it being anything else, at first.
Now as I have studied, and listened in class, I have some issues I am not sure about. First, in Rev 12 from v 1 to the end of verse 9, the events are clearly taking place in heaven. I believe that while things happen in the spiritual realm, there are also connected events or parallels here Earth. I could not figure out where the fleeing to the wilderness came in, and the drawing we did in class confused me a little. I started thinking about a woman on Earth having a baby and fleeing (Mary). However, I have come to the conclusion that Mary is not really important here. I do think though that there are time gaps in what John saw that maybe weren't clearly recorded. It's like when you look in the distance and see the mountains, you don't realize that the drive between the closest one and the farthest one might be days! I really don't think we can assume that the events in Rev happened one right after the other. It doesn't make sense that Jesus was born and went to the throne and then right away there was this war. I think starting in rev 12:7, those events are still to come. I'm not sure about the first recording of the woman fleeing. Did he just see it early and record it but they don't actually flee until v 14? That would line up more with what we learned in Matthew 24 about Israel fleeing sometime in the future.
out of room, hang on.....
I started contemplating the woman in the spiritual realm being Eve b/c
ReplyDeleteof the prophecy I mentioned in Gen 3:15. Not only does Jesus come from
Israel but He is very importantly Eve's seed. Now, I was still
confusing the dragon and the beast and the wound on one of the beasts
heads (thanks Leah). But I think God can have many different "meanings"
for things and I am not convinced that the woman couldn't be a symbol
of at least Eve and Israel. My reasoning for that is that I have
searched the Hebrew word for the word woman used in Rev 12:1 and it
means woman, a feminine noun. I also searched the Hebrew word for
Israel and although I did not read every scripture that it's used in
(there are at least hundreds) in the ones I did read, that word is
always a masculine noun. Now why would God all of a sudden make Israel
feminine unless there was a feminine component, like Eve?
Did that answer your question? It can be so hard for me to gather my
thoughts with kids interrupting me and my brain working as I'm typing.
It wanders sometimes :)
Yeah...actually Katie...your response helped a lot. Like I said earlier, when I first looked through the revelation text I thought about Eve as well. Your reasoning was a lot more thorough than mine was, but I've got to be honest...even though I might not agree with everything - you've brought up some very interesting points.I don't know that I will ever figure it out on my own but I like your thought process and it helped me to hear you talk through how you got there. That is why I asked you to do that for me. So...thanks! I appreciate you taking the time to type it out.
ReplyDeleteI hope that my comment about you being "eager to interpret" didn't come across negative. I really didn't write it with that in mind. I am also eager to interpret because you are right..you can't stay in observation forever or it would never get you anywhere!
Ok...gotta run...time to feed Roman again.